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Torsten
USA
401 Posts |
 Posted - 06/21/2005 : 10:57:07 AM
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| A topic of much debate!!!!!!! So, there is no reason whatsoever why a woman can't be just as good or better than a man at pool. Yet a woman starts as a 3 handicap while a man starts as a 4. WTF!!!??? |
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trhxke
USA
142 Posts |
Posted - 06/21/2005 : 1:32:48 PM
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I agree!
Sounds like the APA was conceived by some male chauvanist pigs.
Seriously though...
Pool is one sport that women should be able to compete on a level field and yet the rules make special allowances for them against us.
What's that all about?
I have certainly lost my share of matches to a WOMAN
Tom Hardinger
www.BigRigToys.com
Your Internet Source for pool cues, darts and colletibles. |
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Big Casino
USA
13 Posts |
Posted - 06/21/2005 : 2:54:46 PM
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Ok so here is my take. I totally agree that pool should be an equal sport. But it is strange when at the pro levels they do "challenges" Men pros win 86 percent of the matches against women pros. I actually asked Dr Cue at his APA exibition why that was and he pointed out two things that were facts. First of all the majority of male pros are taller than women. So they can play shape for diffrent and longer reach shots without the bridge. It is much easier to stroke the ball and get to your next shot without a bridge. Women being shorter tend to play more shape near rails to better reach their next shot. Yet this causes less chance for a run out since in 9 ball the center is best for shape. If you watcha pro match women rarely have more than 2 break and runs in a race to 7 yet men average close to 4 break and runs in a race to 9. And issue #2 is the break. Most and I said most men generate a higher break speed than women getting a way diffrent spread. There are far more safety plays in womens pool. And less innings in mens. Now people before you go nuts this isnt my opinion. I dont agree or disagree but facts are facts and their must be an explanation. Also this is just for 9 ball. I have no clue why women start lower in 8 ball since it isnt a run out game. In fact I think women should start higher than men because they are master strategists and 8 ball is all strategic.
Jason P Moser |
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davidh
USA
2 Posts |
Posted - 06/21/2005 : 5:47:05 PM
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I take offense at the "women are better strategists..." comment. Just kidding...
I think the reason for women starting as a '3' in APA is more statistical, in that over time, the APA has found that most women who start playing APA are about a '3' skill level and most men are about a '4' skill level. Of course there are always exceptions...
Take Care,
David |
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Kerry Randolph
USA
172 Posts |
Posted - 06/22/2005 : 11:31:18 AM
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| The one thing you have to remember about rules like this one is it has to cover a lot of players of varying skill level. A happy medium has to be found to make it fair for everyone and not just the low or high level players. Every rule will have people that are exceptions to it. |
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ApaMVP
USA
19 Posts |
Posted - 06/22/2005 : 12:09:28 PM
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| you all mean "MEN" aren't better than women? shhhhhh, nobody tell my Girlfriend! :) |
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lukecm
7 Posts |
Posted - 06/23/2005 : 07:39:37 AM
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| It just seems to me that, regardless of any statistical differences between men and women, it is a bias for the APA to start women at a lower skill level. If the Equalizer system works, then shouldn't it adjust automatically for the difference in skill level based upon performance? |
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trhxke
USA
142 Posts |
Posted - 06/23/2005 : 11:29:25 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by lukecm
It just seems to me that, regardless of any statistical differences between men and women, it is a bias for the APA to start women at a lower skill level. If the Equalizer system works, then shouldn't it adjust automatically for the difference in skill level based upon performance?
My sentiments exactly!
Tom Hardinger
www.BigRigToys.com
Your Internet Source for pool cues, darts and colletibles. |
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Torsten
USA
401 Posts |
Posted - 06/23/2005 : 12:57:27 PM
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From my experience, having played on teams with men and women, the equalizer system does not discriminate. If a woman goes out and wins 2-0 in 3 innings in her first match in apa, she will be a five if not a six the next week. I think the issue at hand is merely the starting handicap for women being one level lower than a man's. So, in the interest of solving this matter, I have developed a very complex system taking all of the following factors into consideration.
1. Which sex is more likely to get hammered throughout the course of their match and the evening.
2. Which sex is more likely to show off for their friends and opponents by attempting rediculous masse kick three rail four ball combinations (yes, you Jonathan Yellow Hawk  )
3. Which sex is more likely to be distracted by game 7 of the NBA finals on tv tonight.
4. Directly related to factor #1, which sex is more likely to forget which is the proper end of the cue to strike the white ball with.
5. Which sex is more likely to laugh too hard to continue their match because the balls on the table coincidentally end up in a semi-phallic representation after the break. (also directly related to factor 1)
Taking all of these into consideration, and plugging the answers into my supercomputer, I have come up with the following results.
Women start as 4s. Men start as..... negative 1s.
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Torsten
USA
401 Posts |
Posted - 06/23/2005 : 1:00:56 PM
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| In all seriousness now, why don't we get the women's opinions? So far, the only ones who have responded to this post are men. I think that if the women of the APA think that their starting rating is fair, we should leave it as is. If they think they should start at the same ranking as the men, then we need to go down the proper avenues to try and make that happen. |
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Phil
USA
829 Posts |
Posted - 06/23/2005 : 2:27:01 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Torsten
In all seriousness now, why don't we get the women's opinions? So far, the only ones who have responded to this post are men. I think that if the women of the APA think that their starting rating is fair, we should leave it as is. If they think they should start at the same ranking as the men, then we need to go down the proper avenues to try and make that happen.
If you only knew where those avenues lead...
Phil
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Torsten
USA
401 Posts |
Posted - 06/23/2005 : 3:24:38 PM
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I've been to our meetings. Judging by your commentary I understand your pessimism.  |
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Jinny
36 Posts |
Posted - 06/23/2005 : 4:17:41 PM
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If I remember correctly, I started as a 2 while they guys started as a 4. That was 10 years ago however.
Phil, does that sound right to you? Did the starting skill levels go up over the last 10 years?
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Phil
USA
829 Posts |
Posted - 06/23/2005 : 4:51:56 PM
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You started in 9-Ball, Jinny.
Phil
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ginger
USA
35 Posts |
Posted - 06/23/2005 : 6:42:21 PM
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Wow! Im amazed that we can function day in and day out, with all these things wrong with the APA. LOL
Come on people, seriously...is it that big of a deal or that much of an unfair advantage??
When your first starting out, your skill level jumps around for weeks on end like a lopsided superball anyway, doesn't it?
Maybe the thought behind it was, unlike most men, MOST women aren't going to sit there and mathematically figure out "If I hit this ball at a 22 degree, semi right , slightly top with a little backspin angle...I'll make that ball sitting right in front of the pocket".
Granted we women want to be treated equally (as long as its benifical to us LOL!) let some things slide.
I wish my childs father wanted to be treated equally during my 10 hours in labor!! Point being, things are never going to be cut and dry down the middle equal, regardless of what rules we change or what rules we're going to complain about tomorrow.
Just hit the darn little white ball, hope the right ones go in, and try not to scratch on the  and most importantly, have fun 
-ginger |
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Torsten
USA
401 Posts |
Posted - 06/24/2005 : 09:16:22 AM
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| Ginger I think the concern is equal parts fairness and perception. Things are probably fair as they are (starting handicaps) seeing as how much handicaps fluctuate early on. But the fact that the starting handicaps are NOT the same can illicit cries of sexism. I tell you, its a good thing Gloria Steinem hasn't got her hands on this one. |
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Gender Bias
Topic Locked
